MSNTV, WebTV, Interactive Television, Set Top Appliance, LBB, Little Black Box, Inexpensive Internet Access, Computer Phobia, Virus Free WWW, Easy To Use 'Net, Table Art, Audioscope Art, Basic HTML, Why Computers Hate Us, Internet For: The Disabled, Elderly, Poor "Just when u think yer life is hard, along comes MSNTV to remind u: it could b WORSE! :)" ~~Rogi

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Wednesday, January 31, 2007

"colossal pictures" +webtv - Google Search 


Interesting history on the UI development at WebTV, before WebTV, other
ITV platforms and what those people are up to, today.

No more cutesy squeeks, logos made of claymation dough, funky baseball
card-type pages, fortune cookies....

They're pretty slick looking "corpies" now!

The times, they r a changin.

Root around; see what you find. Lemme know, ok?

posted by Rogi  # 1/31/2007 11:05:00 PM

the Old, Free Hosts inaccessible to WebTV now 

You're reading http://msntv.blogspot.com

...thanks to those THOUSANDS of idiotic banner ads! And, boy, doesn't table/scope art look GREAT with ads for gambling, male enhancement and other, toxic garbage???

Yeah, Tripod will knock my box off line. Angelfire will, too. Geocities spins like a dervish and clogs my cache.

Mobile phone technology is impacting some sites, such as Google, to reduce the crap through which one must wade in order to access a URL.Hence, there are several new search engines, designed to make URLS easier for mobile phones.They REALLY help with webtv!

This is my MSNTV resources
page: http://rriverstone.com/msntv/resources.html

I have a stripped-down eBay tool and Netflix.Just above these, you'll see two links for google. The first is an easier-loading search engine. Then, once you find your URL, past it into the form field of the SECOND Google link I have on the page. It'll present you with a clean-as-a-whistle, fast-loading URL. It even works on complicated blog sites, with scads of links & photos.

I don't leave home without it!!

The cell phone is rescuing WebTV's crippled, old browser.

posted by Rogi  # 1/31/2007 08:46:00 PM

Follow-Up on alt.discuss.politics.liberal flamer 

He did come back, after I emailed & posted the following:

DON't stop posting! Please.

What I would LOVE for you to do is create a real dialogue with other

You have a LOT to say!

I just refuse to read those freaks' posts. Sometimes, I'll reply to the
subject, but I DON't argue with them any more.

They're abusive and cruel. They're not there to LEARN anything!

Focus on what's GOOD! When you see something interesting, read it,
ponder it and respond to it as thoughtfully and honestly as you can.

We NEED each other! It's a LIBERAL newsgroup: one of the few left on
usenet, let alone alt.discuss. Let's nurture it and help it grow.

If we lead by our own examples, maybe other liberals will return. Then,
we'll have more community and less pain.

I appreciate your zeal, honestly. I'm suggesting you focus it in
positive channels. Those bigots will drain you of every ounce of
courage, hope, compassion and love you have left.

Let's work to build something beautiful. I KNOW you can!

posted by Rogi  # 1/31/2007 08:39:00 PM

Gates on ITV 

My post in news:webtv.help

This is a different platform than either internet or TV as they exist
today; it's rather a synthesis. It's not the same thing as what you are

Here's the news story I saw recently:

I heard Gates on Charlie Rose today. He wouldn't mention WebTV nor MSNTV
by names when he said [paraphrasing] "we had some experience with itv
several years ago." Charlie Rose chuckles, intimating that Gates has
complained about this to Rose, off camera.

He said the infrastructure: telephonic broadband, wireless, etc. weren't
in place then, and that's why these "experiments" were not successful on
a large enough scale (by MicroSoft's standards).

He's also very focused on the potentials of narrowcasting, rather than
broadcasting: targeted audiences.

Despite the fact that he didn't want to be associated in people's minds
with the names, WebTV or MSNTV, he DID SAY THIS:

[paraphrasing] People in the company have urged him to sell off the ITV
division of MicroSoft. They say it isn't making any money, that it isn't
advancing with current technologies, and that it's serving a VERY
LIMITED market.

To this, Gates' response is: we're keeping the ITV division,
essentially, until the last box dies.

Now, nobody else at MicroSoft sees the tremendous product loyalty WebTV
users have shown in the face of: corporate neglect, antiquated browsers,
hostility from PC users, website incompatibility, etc. But I infer from
Gates' statement that he recognizes it. I still don't like, respect or
trust the fellow, but I will give him that much.

posted by Rogi  # 1/31/2007 08:31:00 PM

Gates on ITV 

I was watching an interview with Charlie Rose just now. Gates would NOT
mention WebTV, nor even MSNTV, by name. He said, basically, "we did some
work with itv about ten years ago, and it didn't work out. Some of my
people are advising me to dump that portion of microsoft, but I tell
them, 'no.'"

The gist of it is this: gates knows itv is the wave of the future, that
BROADcasting is outdated; that NARROWcasting is the future; that
broadband, wireless, ipod/zoon, cellular telephony, etc are going to
cause radical changes in how we receive information.

The MAIN reason, he suggested, that his "experiments in the past" with
ITV weren't successful is that broadband wasn't easily and universally
accessible for the set top appliance.

Basically, in addition to xbox & zoon, gates is saying he anticipates a
global revival in itv.

Keep your hat on.

posted by Rogi  # 1/31/2007 08:24:00 PM

Tuesday, January 30, 2007

to a developer of Blogger Mobile 

You're reading http://msntv.blogspot.com

blogger mobile

Forgive personal email.

Blogger used to be accessible to me on webtv. With Google IE 7.o
requirements, I can't post and webtvs can't reply to blogger posts. Our
browser is IE 3.0. I know. But we can't upgrade, and MSN has lost
interest in us.

I tried writing to your go@ address, to try a test post. No reply.

I'm SURE, with MINOR tweaking, your system can be revised so low-income
people on webtvs can blog!

WebTV subscribers are a resourceful lot, as we get little support from
MSN. We've discovered mobile eBay & mobile Google. They both work FAST
on webtv! Well, except I can't purchase a BuyItNow item.

I can promise product loyalty, if you can help us get access to blogger
and to Google groups, if you're able to direct me to the right people

We're not thrilled about our antique browsers. We're just doin' the best
we can, dude!

PLEASE help!


Rogi Riverstone

posted by Rogi  # 1/30/2007 09:52:00 AM


You're reading http://msntv.blogspot.com

Subject : news:alt.discuss.politics.liberal
When I worked to get this ng started, I had really hoped it could be a
place for some thoughtful and serious discussion.

We had alt.discuss.politics and we had
alt.discuss.politics.conservative, but no .liberal. I felt that was out
of balance. Fortunately, enough voters, liberal and conservative,

I had hoped people could actually examine ideas, really look at them and
discuss them.

Unfortunately, the toxins of alt.discuss have infested this spot, too.
My experience is that you don't want to discuss. You want to battle,
shock, insult.

If you use the tactics of your opponent, how are you any different FROM
your opponent? I was hoping to meet some people who could agree to
disagree without these silly flame wars.
I've posted many, thoughtful articles in here. They're buried now.
Nobody saw them. Nobody commented.
There seem to be neither conservatives nor liberals allowed in this ng.
It seems to be only for lamers.

I don't blame the "rednecks." They live in a toxic, abusive atmosphere,
where conformity to the Law of the Bully is their twisted and inaccurate
measure of "success." They have abusive: fathers, gods, ministers,
presidents and bosses; they don't know any better. They're castrated and

They're sexually frustrated, emotionally insecure, poorly-educated,
insulated from the real world, wallowing in their middle class
privilege, smug and ignorant.

They delight in cruelty and pettiness. They don't care about -- and take
pride in -- inflicting suffering. And then, they'll call themselves,
"Christians." Their kind killed their so-called, "savior."

They'll never know what a joy life is.

As far as I'm concerned, they're a dying breed of psychological
cripples: gasping their last, fetid words; inflicting their final,
insipid damage; spreading the sickness in which they fester as best
their dried hearts can.

But I refuse to identify with someone who claims to be a "liberal," yet
resorts to the same tactics.

I have my own damage (as do they), thank you, which I must work (unlike
they) hard, every hour, to overcome. I'm tempted to act like them, sure,
and I have.

But, while it offers a temporary release from the pain, it doesn't heal
me. What I need is a conversation, based on logic, sincere concern for
human dignity, and actual knowledge of the issues.

I seldom see that in here. I certainly don't see it from these
reactionary bigots. But I also don't see it from you.

So, I must assume that you're only here for a flame war.
I feel more betrayed by you than by them.

posted by Rogi  # 1/30/2007 09:50:00 AM

Monday, January 29, 2007

Google Searches 

You're reading http://msntv.blogspot.com

THIS one is very WebTV friendly! Strips out extraneous html!

From: spade1313 --
Subject: Google Links, etc. Sent: Monday, January 22, 2007 3:09 PM

http://groups.google.com (brings you to google groups)
http://images.google.com (brings you to picture search)
http://gmail.google.com (brings you to gmail)
http://www.google.com/gwt/n (brings you to google's mobile search page)
http://www.google.com/ie (brings you to a barebones version of google's
search page)
http://maps.google.com (brings you to google maps)
http://news.google.com (brings you to google news)
http://froogle.google.com (brings you to google's froogle page)
http://books.google.com (brings you to google book page)
google's advanced search page:
http://www.google.com/advanced_search?hl=en (can also activate safe
search here)
google's translation tools:
google's advanced option page:
google basics:
google cheat sheet:
Google Searches
http://www.googlism.com (the world according to google)
http://elgoog.rb-hosting.de/index.cgi (backwards google search)
http://www.alltooflat.com/geeky/elgoog/m/index.cgi (same as above)
http://www.gahooyoogle.com (searches yahoo and google together)
http://twingine.com (searches yahoo and google together)
http://google.fergusons.dk (3 google searches on 1 page)
http://www.google.com/ig/usgov (search government sites)
http://scholar.google.com (google scholar search)
http://q4q.org/ (google X)
http://www.google.com/gwt/n (mobile version)
http://www.google.com/ie (barebones version)
http://www.void.be/googletool.html (different google datacenters ? )
http://www.scroogle.org/cgi-bin/scraper.htm (hides your info from google
http://www.google.com/intl/xx-hacker/ (google in hacker language? )
http://www.google.com/intl/xx-bork/ (google in swedish chef language? )
http://www.google.com/intl/xx-elmer/ (google in elmer fudd language? )
http://www.google.com/intl/xx-klingon/ (google in klingon language? )
http://www.google.com/intl/xx-piglatin/ (google in pig latin language? )
http://www.google.com/help/features.html (more google searches)
http://www.google.com/heart/heart01.html ("i love you" version)
http://www.google.com/heart/feature_cons.html ("i love you" #2 version)
http://www.google.com/Easter/feature_easter.html (easter version)
http://www.google.com/mentalplex/ (mentalplex version)
http://www.googoth.com (google goth)
http://www.cfc.free.fr/Google/ (a little to the left)
http://www.googleaprilfools.com (google april fools search)
see Google's cached version of a site with the cache: command
will bring you this page:
*results set to 100
have google act as a dictionary with the define: command example:
brings up:
*results set to 100
you can lookup results by words in the title intitle: will look for a
single word in a title of an address
*results set to 100
alllintitle: will look for multiple words in a title of an address
allintitle:monkey secrets
*results set to 100
if you use this as a F-key it's automatically set for 100 results per
page, erase - in the search box and
type your search terms
Google: results in domain
in the search box type either inurl: (which will look at the entire web
address) or site: (which will look for results in a certain domain) or
(below example results are set for 100 per page)
help site:webtv.net
help inurl:webtv
help site:webtv.net inurl:asp
help inurl:asp site:webtv.net
you can also experiment with allinurl: if you are looking for more than
one term in an address
allinurl:webtv help html
In the search box enter search terms followed by filetype:
example this is the search results for
birds filetype:jpg
Image Search Fix for Google
add &nojs=1 at the end of the URL
for example
change to
and the pics will show

posted by Rogi  # 1/29/2007 06:11:00 PM

Sunday, January 28, 2007

Internet to revolutionize TV in 5 years 

This is a scary man! Heil MSN!

You're reading http://msntv.blogspot.com



Internet to revolutionize TV in 5 years: Gates
By Ben HirschlerSat Jan 27, 5:02 PM ET
The Internet is set to revolutionize television within five years, due to an explosion of online video content and the merging of PCs and TV sets, Microsoft chairman Bill Gates said on Saturday.

"I'm stunned how people aren't seeing that with TV, in five years from now, people will laugh at what we've had," he told business leaders and politicians at the World Economic Forum.

The rise of high-speed Internet and the popularity of video sites like Google Inc.'s YouTube has already led to a worldwide decline in the number hours spent by young people in front of a TV set.

In the years ahead, more and more viewers will hanker after the flexibility offered by online video and abandon conventional broadcast television, with its fixed program slots and advertisements that interrupt shows, Gates said.

"Certain things like elections or the Olympics really point out how TV is terrible. You have to wait for the guy to talk about the thing you care about or you miss the event and want to go back and see it," he said.
"Internet presentation of these things is vastly superior."

At the moment, watching video clips on a computer is a separate experience from watching sitcoms or documentaries on television.

But convergence is coming, posing new challenges for TV companies and advertisers.

"Because TV is moving into being delivered over the Internet -- and some of the big phone companies are building up the infrastructure for that -- you're going to have that experience all together," Gates said.
YouTube co-founder Chad Hurley said the impact on advertising would be profound, with the future promising far more targeted ads tailored to each viewer's profile.

"In the coming months we're going to do experiments to see how people interact with these ads to build an effective model that works for advertisers and works for users," he said.

Advertisers are already racing to adapt their strategies to the growing power of the Web, and more and more promotional cash is tipped to migrate from television to Web sites in future.

Copyright © 2007 Reuters Limited. All rights reserved. Republication or redistribution of Reuters content is expressly prohibited without the prior written consent of Reuters. Reuters shall not be liable for any errors or delays in the content, or for any actions taken in reliance thereon.

posted by Rogi  # 1/28/2007 10:33:00 AM

Saturday, January 27, 2007


You're reading http://msntv.blogspot.com

Table Wizards http://mrgems.users2.50megs.com/TableWizards.html
la de Boheme http://www.wtv-zone.com/LadyBoheme/thelast/main.html
Cullen's Slide Show

MrsK's Scopin Images http://www.wtv-zone.com/MsV/lessons/index.html
Ms V Tutorial http://www.wtv-zone.com/MsV2/lessons/scopes.html.gz
Scopes by Design http://www.geocities.com/msv_one/scopes/

Count Down Banners:
Siggiez http://siggiez.com/countdownz/index.cgi

HTML Tutorials:
Basics http://www.wtv-zone.com/Angelaruth49/Circle.html
Blue Fox http://www.wtv-zone.com/bluefox/
DHTML http://jawjahboy.com/DHTML/DHTML.shtml
Draac http://www.draac.com/
Gest http://www.wtv-zone.com/phyrst/
HTML Help http://www.htmlhelp.com/
TandemTables http://tandemtables.com/
Transitions & Moving Backgrounds http://www.geocities.com/willxwill/transitions/index.html
TyHart Tutes http://s91440092.onlinehome.us/tytutes/indexa.html

Butt Ugly Backgrounds: http://victorian.fortunecity.com/palace/696/index.html

Imaging Tools:
Playmaster http://www.playmaster101.com/IMAGEMASTER101/RAPE-AND-PILLAGE/ImageMaster101.php
DJMike's totally awesome go check it out I mean it image tool: http://eclecticdjs.com/mike/wtv/tools/sizer/sizer.phphttp://eclecticdjs.com/mike/wtv/tools/sizer/sizer_c.phphttp://eclecticdjs.com/mike/wtv/tools/sizer/sizer.txt
Imaging Tutorials:
PaintShopPro http://www.psptoybox.com/links/psp7/7links.htm
Image Art Tutorial http://www.wtv-zone.com/kosh46/magic/index.html
Emboss-Glow http://www.wtv-zone.com/MsV2/lessons/glo.html
Image Magick Tutorials http://community-2.webtv.net/witchoftaylor/im/
Image Magick Tutorials http://members.tripod.com/~ImageMagick/index.html
LingoLinda http://www.lingolinda.com/
Ms V's Background/Frame Magic http://www.wtv-zone.com/MsV2/lessons/frames.html
Transloading http://members.tripod.com/~grandma_joe_2000/LearnTransloading.html
Transparency Basics http://www.net4tv.com/net4TV/u2u/TRANSP1.HTM

BeeLine Tips & Tricks http://www.bton.com/tb16/jsref.html
Byte Budget Tutorial http://jawjahboy.com/scripts/byte-budget.shtml
JavaScript & Other Voodoo http://www.wtv-zone.com/kosh46/new/Voodoo.html

Link Exchanges:
Ultra Tex Links http://ult-tex.net/links/index.cgi
WebTV PageBuilder Sites http://wtv-zone.com/ozarkman/Peeps-pgs.html

GoHere PHPLinks http://dlilahl.net/LINKS/GOHERE.PHPLINKS.html

Sign Generators:
Get your own Hollywood star http://www.getyourownstar.com/

I play 50's to 80's oldies and classic rock:Vern's Radio

Source Viewers:

WebTV History:
WebTV Preservation Society
Colossal Pictures WebTV only
EDucation @ webtv WebTV only
Club Webtv on alt.discuss

WebTV ... um ... well, I don't want to lose my subscription, so I'll just post these w/out explanation. And I WON'T tell you how I got them, either!

http://vega.webtv.net/corp/clubwebtv/cwtv1097/feedback.html http://help.webtv.net/ http://itv.webtv.net/examples/index.html http://itv.webtv.net/switcher/index.html http://itv.webtv.net/testcases/flash/index.html http://search.msntv.msn.com/search/Categories.aspx http://www.angelfire.com/nj/Webtvuser/index1.html http://www.net4tv.com/proactive/webtvhtm2.htm http://www.geocities.com/MadisonAvenue/9386/webtv.html http://members.tripod.com/~nytak/wtv_tricks.html Don't hurt yourself.

posted by Rogi  # 1/27/2007 11:17:00 AM

TV or PC? 

You're reading http://msntv.blogspot.com

tv or pc?


I'm very lucky. I have access to a WebTV PM+ and several computers,
including a mac powerbook. Our house is wired with DSL (mostly to keep
down the bickering about who gets to be online NOW!).
So, when I get frustrated with trying to surf on an antique browser, I
just reach for a computer, while the WebTV's online, and do what I need
to do.

I believe WebTV, in its current form, can't last much longer. Too many
sites are inaccessible now (I'm the one who can't write my blog from my
lbb & my webbie readers can't post comments, 'tho we can all read the
blog from LBBs).

Here's why we ol' school webbies hang on: community.

Have you ever tried to locate a MSN group? Their "search this site"
loads results that aren't groups! It's frustrating and aggrevating to
look for a topic (in my most recent searches, "Burning Man" & "WebTV")
and get thousands of irrelevent results! I still don't know if they have
any (of hundreds of thousands of groups) WebTV MSN Groups!
The internet is a lonely place. Oh, sure, there are millions of
websites. One day's worth of youtube would take an entire lifetime to

But WebTV had chats. We have, although they're officially "not supported
by MSN anymore" (1 800 GOWEBTV CSR), alt.discuss, what's left of it.
We found each other. We built communities together. We met and got
married in chat rooms. We taught each other html, javascript, php,
dhtml, CSS, Imaps, ming.

Now that many of us have moved on to computers, we've tried to establish
forums, chat groups, etc. But we're scattering to the winds. Old links
don't work. The alt.discuss.memorials.webtv newsgroup is full of grief.
I visit some of the forums. I frequently see posts that say, "I miss my

No, they miss our Family. They miss having people to answer questions,
support our struggles to learn how to optimize our online experiences.
They miss the corny esigs and the bad jokes.

On a computer, I'm completely responsible for everything the appliance
does. If I don't have good antivirus, if there's a sudden power surge or
static charge, if I open the wrong attachment, if I didn't install a
plug in or some soft- or hardware.... I could end up in big trouble.
It's my job to learn all that or pay someone who already knows it to do
it for me. It's lonely and frightening. It all sounds so foreign and

Some of us have real reasons why we won't learn all that and can't pay
someone to do it for us.

One thing I really love about WebTV is that it's accessible. Twenty +
bucks a month isn't chicken feed for some of us. But the appliance was
accessible and replaceable. And we didn't need to be techies. We took it
out of the box, plugged it in, and it walked us through.

We are and were taxi drivers, waitresses, disabled, elderly, janitors...
And we learned to build web pages, even ART web pages. We started
hosting businesses and became webmasters. We began broadcasting our own,
home grown media. The technology was accessible.

That's what those of us who've "moved on" miss about WebTV. WE are the
LBB. We miss ourselves and each other.

WebTV was a singular phenomenon. I don't think anything like it will
happen again, not in my life time, anyway.

I'm proud and humbled to have been here for most of it. I've made
lifetime friends. It's not the appliance; it's the community.

posted by Rogi  # 1/27/2007 10:52:00 AM

Thursday, January 18, 2007

plantation mentality 

You're reading http://msntv.blogspot.com

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 15:55:46 -0800
"Rogi Riverstone"
Re: [KUNMIDEAS-L] Fwd: plantation Mentality

I just lost my free speech to blog. Google bought
Blogger. Now, I can't access it from my WebTV. I must
use a computer. I'm privileged; most webtv users don't
own and can't afford a computer. Their blogging is
See: http://msntv.blogspot.com/
Rogi Riverstone

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 16:42:37 -0800
"megan kamerick"
Re: [KUNMIDEAS-L] transcript of moyers speech

it's here
--- Halima Christy wrote:
> tried to send this earlier-- hope you are tuned
> in to this-
> --- the forwarded message follows ---
> > From: "Halima Christy"
> Subject: plantation Mentality

> Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 11:46:44 -0700
> hi-
> i just heard a very unusual media speech- on
> "Democracy
> Now"
> (on TV- 10am Ch27 in Abq) by BILL MOYERS at the
> Media
> Conference in Memphis--
> Moyers passionately spoke- fire in his belly!--
> about
> --'elite plunder' of the very rich across the boards
> in US
> --- in everything, including radio, tv , cable,
> and they are going after internet more than we
> dreamed...
> -- conspiracy of the rich
> --"The American Dream vs The Gospel of wealth" (a
> book)
> --Censorship of Knowledge in the Media for last 50
> years
> -- Oligarchy's 'view from the top' in all media, and
> the
> effect it has repressing democracy
> --Media language concealing reality
> -- time to challenge the "Plantation mentality' we
> are all
> being subjected to by Washington & the corp
> media
> -- great book called "Digital Destiny"- must read
> for
> media lovers
> It seems like Moyers really did listen to Jos
> Campbell and
> to
> many of the healers in both of his historic series
> in the
> 80's
> while so many others were opting into the yuppie
> dream....
> Moyers
> talks about salvaging freedom of the press with
> digital-
> even tho
> the corp plundering has started--
> R Murdoch bought 'myspace', and Google already
> bought
> Utube, etc, etc--
> Moyers notes that with digital, 'everyman' has a
> pen, is a
> Tom
> Paine, and corp cannot be the only storywriters...
> Hoping that we all understand the nefarious
> ramifications
> of
> the 'plantation mentality', Moyers said maybe the
> civil
> rights
> movement in media starts when we stand up from our
> obsequious
> labors and realize " this ain't the product of
> intelligent
> design"
> He spoke of the original goals for radio- "classroom
> for
> the Air",
> and how they were exchanged for commercial
> sponsorship
> goals in the
> 40's and 50's....
> THIS is a GREAT speech, not to be missed by anyone
> who
> values
> Free Speech in any form. As one who worked in the
> FSM-
> the Free Speech Movement
> meetings started in the house next to mine on
> Carleton
> Street,
> and i have never fully recovered from that blast of
> intelligence-
> listening to Mario Savio, (whom i sometimes think
> of as
> the
> 'last best orator), and the others, being present at
> Sproul Hall Plaza
> from the first FSM demonstration on== with all the
> police
> tear gas
> attacks and arrests, etc etc--
> i don't get to hear GREAT SPEECHES nearly enough--
> most
> politicians
> and media people seem possessed with serious early
> Alzheimer's..
> (except for public media, bien sur),
> and the ONLY national TV show (are there others?)
> worth
> attention
> seems to be DEMOCRACY NOW-- which helps me
> to believe that free speech/democracy is just
> temporarily
> comatose..
> HEART....
> TREAT YOURSELF to some sane and brilliant thinking--
> listen today
> at 4 pm on www.KUNM.org (Albq time) if you are out
> of the
> area,
> to Bill Moyers on "Will the media foster democracy
> or
> quench it?"
> Health democracy for all,
> Halima

posted by Rogi  # 1/18/2007 09:44:00 AM

Monday, January 15, 2007

no contact with WebTV 

You're reading http://msntv.blogspot.com

16 Jan 2007 03:01:49 -0000
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Mon, 15 Jan 2007 19:01:44 PST
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 19:01:44 -0800 (PST)
From: Rogi Riverstone
Subject: Fwd:am I banned from alt.discuss?
To: support4u@corp.webtv.net
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/mixed;
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Message-ID: <44126.85241.qm@web33507.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
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--- Rogi Riverstone wrote:
> From: (Rogi Riverstone)
> Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 18:19:13 -0700
> To: usenet@corp.webtv.net
> Subject: am I banned from alt.discuss?
> None of my posts to several newgroups (clubs not
> affected) have appeared
> since before the weekend.
> I'm concerned that I may have violated some TOS
> unknowingly.
> I am having problems with the new Google system. I
> asked, in a few
> groups, if anybody had a "hack" to get around their
> new browser
> requirements. I assure you: I did NOT mean a
> "Crack," as in malicious
> attack. I simply need a workaround, so I can sign in
> to my blog and
> Google groups.
> I am worried that my posts may have been
> misinterpreted, given recent
> events involving attacks on @webtv.net addresses.
> It was never my intention to: harm anyone, break any
> laws, violate
> copywrites, steal or otherwise cause any damage to
> anyone. I just wanted
> to write in my blog from my webtv.
> What can I do to correct the situation?
> Thanks,
> Rogi
> >

What's an IRC? 

You're reading http://msntv.blogspot.com

What's an IRC
IRC: Internet Relay Chat
It's a format by which WebTV can easily link to real-time chat rooms.
Everybody types into the room, the text scrolls up. You get to have
real-time conversations with people.
The IRC I built will take you directly into the "room" of the Sunday
afternoon http://chat4tv.com chat. It's a bunch of friends, hanging
telling stories. We've been together about 10 years now. People have
actually gotten MARRIED in our chat rooms! Businesses have formed.
celebrated births and mourned deaths.
Chat4tv is owned by Laura Buddine, a pioneer in research on interactive
television (webtv and other platforms), where people connect to the
internet via their television sets.
Laura, or Dudette, as we call her, also owns and operates
http://net4tv.com which is a multitude of resources, including image
manipulation, sound files, people of color American History, and a
wonderful internet magazine called, "Net4tv Voice," for which I wrote
articles for several years.
In the last, several years, she has expanded yet another venture,
http://games4tv.com : a source of online games. She works diligently to
make these accessible to all platforms: webtv, webtv plus, msntv2,
computers, macs & apples. They also work for several, international set
top boxes, designed for cable tvs, particularly in hotel chains around
the world.
Sunday evenings, we chat from 3pm, pacific time, until about 6 or 7pm,
depending on who wants to stick around. We have a trivia game every
week. We talk about what's new in technological innovation, the impact
of it on culture, etc. It's pretty much everything, from geek to greek.
If you ever feel like meeting some of the NICEST people who ever owned
webtv, you could pop in one weekend. Some of these people have done
phenomenally innovative stuff, all of which they learned as regular
subscribers, not as corporate types with degrees in the field.
So, that's IRC. If you'd ever like to just practice chatting, shoot me
an email and I'll "meet" you in the "room" and we can go over all the
buttons, ok?

posted by Rogi  # 1/15/2007 07:42:00 AM

I'm mad as hell at Google... 

You're reading http://msntv.blogspot.com

"Rogi Riverstone"
Mon, 15 Jan 2007 06:26:12 -0700
"ZboX Webhosting" CC

I'm mad @ google
... and I'm not gonna take it anymore!

They've "upgraded" http://blogger.com and http://blogspot.com since
Google took over. You need a Google password to get in to blog.
Well, it's not, of course, compatible with the webtv browser. Ppl can
still READ my blog from a webtv, but can't post comments. I can't log
from a webtv anymore.
I have to write a blog about webtv from a COMPUTER?!?!
I wrote several emails to Google over the weekend; we'll see if I get a
response from a human, not a bot. I'm going to CALL Google today, but
I'm not too hopeful.
So, it looks like I'll be moving at least one of my blogs to your
program: http://msntv.blogspot.com
It won't happen this month. But, if Google doesn't REALLY make
information accessible, no matter one's economic disadvantages (two of
their ten principles, and I'm holding them to it!), I'll have to move.
The only reason I didn't start with YOUR blogging script is the
advantage of Google, placing my blogs in their search results. I can
around that, though, by placing a customized Google search engine on
new blog. barstards!
Imagine how BAD I felt, knowing I've been handing out a link to a blog
about webtv, but webtv people couldn't COMMENT on it! I'm not one of
those prima donna types, who thinks MY word is gawd, but anybody else's
comments are unworthy!
Looks like I'll b blogging at http://zboxhosting.com soon!

posted by Rogi  # 1/15/2007 07:27:00 AM

Saturday, January 13, 2007

blogger, google incompatible with WebTV now 

You're reading http://msntv.blogspot.com

[#100366532] blogger webtv incompatiblehttp://blogger.com redirected me automatically to:http://www.blogger.com/app/nocookies.html where I saw this: Blogger Sign In WE FOUND THE FOLLOWING ERRORS:Your browser's cookie functionality is disabled. Please enable JavaScript and cookies in order to use Blogger. Blogger Help explains how. The "blogger help explains how." link did not function. I've since cleared my cookies. My internet appliance is functioning at maximum. I've done everything I can on my end. Your website is no longer compatible. I can't blog!
Attachment: Forwarded Message
Fri, 12 Jan 2007 23:04:15 -0000
"Google Help"
Re: [#100366532] blogger webtv incompatible

Thank you for your note. This is an automated response and request for
information about your disabled account. So that we can investigate the
situation, please provide a detailed description of what happened when
your account became disabled. For example, had you recently tried to
change the email address associated with your account or received any
emails about your email address being changed?
Please note that you'll receive a further reply only if we require more
information to investigate or if we have an update about your account.
The Google Team
Original Message Follows:
From: rriverstone

Subject: blogger webtv incompatible
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 15:03:41 -0800
Blogger login is no longer compatible with webtv. I can't post in my
blogs and I can't contact anybody about it, because I don't belong to any
Google groups. Your Google sign up is incompatible, too.
Other_product: blogger
Language: en
IssueType: other
Situation: disabled_account

Friday, January 12, 2007

WEBTV access to Ebay ??? 

You're reading http://msntv.blogspot.com

Here's something I stumbled on today, 1/15:

Fixes for WebTV eBay Problems: September 2006


From: "spade1313 --"

Subject: Re: WEBTV access to Ebay ???

Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 12:06:36 -0800

see if Ebay's Mobile version works:



http://www.auctionstealer.com is also great for sniping ebay auctions

posted by Rogi  # 1/12/2007 06:05:00 PM

Spam Info 

You're reading http://msntv.blogspot.com

From: "spade1313 --"

Subject: Spam Info

Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 11:49:27 -0800

How Spammers Harvest E-mail

About Spam

Spammer's tricks:

Spam Control:

Spam FAQ:
http://gandalf.home.digital.net/spamfaq.html (long)

Spam How Can I Help Make a difference?

Webtv's Spam Blacklist Search:

DNS Tools:

Abuse Lookup:

Reporting Abuse Yahoo:

Reporting Abuse Hotmail:

Ebay Abuse:
spoof@ebay.com (spoof emails)
spam@ebay.com (spam emails)

posted by Rogi  # 1/12/2007 06:01:00 PM

Image Hosting/Transloaders 

You're reading http://msntv.blogspot.com

From: "spade1313 --"

Subject: Image Hosting/Transloaders

Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 11:39:29 -0800

(ftp compatible)

about uploading pics:

webtv help:


domania ftp transloader
http://freeload.domania.net/freeload.html (simple)
http://ftpws.domania.net (advanced)

info about the advanced link:

posted by Rogi  # 1/12/2007 05:56:00 PM

Monday, January 08, 2007

YAHOO info/links 

You're reading http://msntv.blogspot.com

YAHOO info/links

Group: news:alt.discuss.msntv.help Date: Tue, Dec 26, 2006,
10:12am (MST-1) From: spade1313
(spade1313 --)
How to Get Back to Old Yahoo Mailbox
1) sign in
2) hit the info key to see address
which will look something like

all you need is the f and 3 digit number (for every
account the number is different)
3) change the following link to your number and you'll
retrograde back to the old yahoo box

for example if your number is f500, the link is

if your number is f360, the link is

(keep your address for future use in case yahoo tries
to upgrade your mailbox again or if you log in your
account from a computer which will upgrade your
you can also change the link by clicking one of the
above links after signing in use the go to button
followed by show last and change the link in the go to
box to your number. Once you change the number you'll
go from the Log In has Expired Page to your inbox.
Yahoo Mail Upgrade Page Bypass:
if you're stuck on the annoying yahoo mail
beta/upgrade notice page when you sign in, reload the
page twice and you'll go to your mail box
Bigger Yahoo Search Box:
Reporting Abuse Yahoo:
Yahoo Hide Online Status:

Yahoo Marketing Preferences:
sign in & uncheck boxes to unsubscribe
Yahoo Mail Avoiding Deletion:
When are dormant accounts removed?

If an account has not been logged into for over four
months, it will become "dormant."
Dormant accounts are de-activated at the end of four
months. Once an account is deactivated, you will no
longer have access regardless of whether or not email
has been received in the account during that time.
Once an account has been de-activated, we cannot
retrieve any of the information that was formerly
stored in it.
Please Note: Subscribing to any of the Yahoo! Mail
Premium Services will prevent your account from going
dormant due to inactivity. To learn more about the
individual services and sign up, please visit:
Yahoo! Mail Plus
Yahoo! Mail Personal Address
By subscribing to one of the Yahoo! Mail Premium
Services, you will no longer need to sign in
periodically to keep your account active.
Yahoo Shortcuts/Blank Page Problem fix
new yahoo shortcut ad appears on top of page causing a
blank screen. I've only seen the problem come up on
one of my accounts once. So far I've been trying to
get the blank screen back so I can test solutions out.
So I can only tell you what worked for me.
Either one of these links should work (I switched back
to the old version before using, but I don't think if
it matters much) <--- Instructions for old yahoo mail switch are on the bottom note: replace f101 with your number (see instructions on bottom) This is the one Yahoo shortcuts gives you if the ad loads: http://us.f101.mail.yahoo.com/ym/Preferences?YY=0&y5beta=yes&consentLW=1

I used the next one because the ad didn't load and all
I saw was a blank screen (nearly identical). on the
old version of yahoo mail it brings up the two yahoo
mailboxes glitch on one page (one upper and one lower)
click check mail on the lower half visible half and
you're in.

How to Get Back to Old Yahoo Mailbox
1) sign in
2) hit the info key to see address
which will look something like

all you need is the f and 3 digit number (for every
account the number is different)
3) change the following link to your number and you'll
retrograde back to the old yahoo box

for example if your number is f500, the link is

if your number is f360, the link is

(keep your address for future use in case yahoo tries
to upgrade your mailbox again or if you log in your
account from a computer which will upgrade your
you can also change the link by clicking one of the
above links after signing in use the go to button
followed by show last and change the link in the go to
box to your number. Once you change the number you'll
go from the Log In has Expired Page to your inbox.

Update, 1/15:

Larry, I'm sorry. I don't know a good way to get around this junk withYahoo.Yahoo automatically suspends or deletes email accounts for inactivityafter a certain number of days. They don't CARE that you're the ownerof, or poster to, various Yahoo groups, even though they use your@yahoo.com address to allow you to post! But they'll suspend yourowner/moderator privileges in a heart beat!You probably haven't been "banned" for violation of their Terms ofService. Of course, I don't KNOW you, but you don't seem like aterrorist, spammer, pedophile or other reprobate to me! You're probablycut off because you weren't using your yahoo mail in the required time.It's an automatic program Yahoo has. No work around.One thing I'd suggest is trying to restore the old email address byre-sign up. It probably won't work, as your yahoo addy is listed in thegroups. But it's worth a try.If that doesn't work, you're going to have to change up your groups, ifyou're the owner. That means, starting new ones and shutting the oldones down (more below.)So, you can sign up for a BRAND NEW Yahoo email address. Just use one ofyour OTHER "user names" on your webtv account. Or, you can use a HotMailaddress, Angelfire....any online email service that's accessible toWebTV. They won't know you're the same person. Then, you can post in the groups, by signing up as a new member of eachgroup.If you're the owner of some groups, you can STILL be able to post inthem. You can announce you're having to create a new group, explain why,and move everybody over to the new one. I'm sorry to say you'll loseyour old post archives. But you can, with a great deal of work (maybesome group members can help you?) move any photos, links, etc. you'vestored in the briefcase sections on the left sidebars of the groups.It's a big pain in the butt, I know.You can TRY to contact Yahoo, but I know how THAT works. Either you getno reply at all, or you get a mailbot that acts like a chimp on crack,assumes YOU don't know what YOU're talking about, but really doesn'tunderstand a thing you've said, and is just puking out canned replies toa few, key words in your emails. grr.Now, if you look VERY carefully in the "contact us" or "about us"sections of Yahoo's (or other people's) websites, you MAY actually comeacross an email address that's connected to a live human being, or youmight get REAL lucky and find a PHONE NUMBER to Yahoo. Don't hold yourbreath, but miracles do still happen.My first suggestion is that you TRY to reapply for your original emailaddress at Yahoo, and see what happens.Do NOT say or do anything threatening, no matter HOW frustrated you are!Go to the newsgroups, if you need a shoulder. That's what we're herefor!Good luck, my brother!The Webbies united can probably be defeated, but we'll make 'em bleedwhile we're going down!

posted by Rogi  # 1/08/2007 07:27:00 AM

Sunday, January 07, 2007

Who's a troll? 

You're reading http://msntv.blogspot.com

I wrote a private email to a woman in the tablesnscopes group. She found it necessary to send it to the owner of the group. I'm not posting their emails here, only my own correspondence.

Are you intentionally pushing other threads up, to bury my submission
the stained glass challenge?

It's the 2nd day in a row you've pushed things up, w/out acknowledging
my submission.

I've seen no feedback on my submission from you in the ng. You've
replied to every other entry, as near as I can tell, except mine.

Have I offended you?

The problem is that I think I've offended you. It seems I have, but I'm
not sure why. And the problem is that it appears you might be
intentionally burying my submission.

I'm just checking this out by asking. I don't want bad feelings between
us. And I was discouraged to see my submission buried.

As to giving feedback to others, I was waiting (probably pointlessly,
seeing how busy the ng is) for stuff to "die down." Whenever there's a
roll call thread in a group, it's usually best -- in my experience --
let that fill up first. Then, I go thru the posts and read stuff. Then,
I reply.

I meant no disrespect by doing this. Truly.

Roll call threads get very long and pop back up to the top very
frequently. Lots of stuff gets pushed down. Once everyone has replied
the roll call thread, it's usually safe to resume "business as usual."

I can't tell, in a vacuum, what's going on with anybody. It has been my
experience that it's best if I just ask questions, when I don't know
what's going on. I don't mean anything aggressive or hostile by it, I'm
just looking for some clarity.

I was disappointed and, naturally, frustrated, that my work was
repeatedly disappearing. I was asking to be sure you weren't
intentionally burying it, for some reason. And, if you are, to ask you
why, so I'll know what's expected of me.

Also, since you seem to be the archivist for Tandem Tables, it's more
likely my work could be included there if you actually get to see it.

I don't want bad blood between us. I'm not accusing you, really. I'm
just asking what's going on, so I'll know how to participate in the ng.

I'm sincerely sorry if I've offended you.

I meant no harm. I am not a troll. I am not being disrespectful. I am
positive and supportive.

Charters are difficult to access. I posted mine on a regular basis in
newsgroup. I didn't know how to access yours. And, quite frankly, I
wasn't expecting to be perceived as disruptive or destructive so, I
didn't research the charter.

It's been two years since I've been on webtv or in newsgroups. I have
forgotten much. Despite your comments re: my intelligence and what you
perceive as my "acting other than," I have serious issues with memory.
don't remember much about webtv, ngs, html or anything else re: my
former experiences on webtv. I'm trying to reconnect and relearn

You seem to have come to some pretty harsh conclusions re: my
motivations. My stance is that you are mistaken.

I wish I could have been given the benefit of the doubt.

I approached this entire situation with deferrence, respect and

I have a feeling that you, sewsally, are extremely angry with me.
Nothing I can say will change that. In fact, it will probably just
inflame the situation further.

Perhaps I'm not the only one with a memory disorder. It would appear
others may have forgotten who I am, what I've done and how I've
contributed to table art and to webtv in general.

This is really causing me a great deal of pain. I really wanted to
participate again. I was very excited that I'd managed to put together
table for the challenge, and do it well before the deadline. It's my
first in two years.

I hesitate to state this, as I'm afraid it will be perceived, by those
who may be looking for "evidence" against me, that I'm soliciting pity.

It is suspected that I live with brain damage, caused by severe child
abuse. My memory is VERY faulty. I am mildly dyslexic. I have
difficulties interfacing in social situations.

But NOTHING I have done --or not done-- in this newsgroup has been of
malicious intent. I am TRYING to succeed.

I need to receive a bit of respect and maybe more patience than is

I stand by my reasons for not posting more in the group. I'm not lying.
I'm not making lame excuses.

Is there anyway we can solve this, or am I persona non grata, no matter
what I try to do to improve things?

So far, I'm not feeling at all hopeful.

Joe, I don't understand how you are replying to an email I sent to

I replied to her. Should I forward that sent email on to you?

Now, apparantly, I've inadvertantly offended two people. I was really
only trying to write to sewsally, though.

Sun Jan 7 02:18:11 2007
Mail to Paul Ding The following message was mailed to Paul Ding
Subject:webtv, amish hosting, etc
Date:Sun, 7 Jan 2007 02:18:11 -0400 (EDT)

Ok, we've met over webnuts. You helped me w/my table script.
I've just been kicked out of the tablesnscopes ng because sewsally came
after me, tooth and claw.

I've been trying to figure out why.

Do you own Amish Hosting?

I mentioned, in the ng, that you had tweaked my codes.

Ever since, sewsally kept burying my thread in the ng. I finally
emailed her to ask why.

Long story short: she accused me of trolling AND she brought Joe, the
ng owner, into it without my consent. Joe threw me out.

I've been trying and trying to find out why. Then, I see a thread in
djmike's PHP ng about sally, accusations of arbor hosting kickbacks, a
script of hers that said Amish was offline, hacking.....

I went to Amish and found posts galore from PaulDing. I came to
PaulDing.net and here we are.

I do believe I've been banned from a newsgroup, simply because I
mentioned your name!

Does any of this sound real?

Thanks for your time,

Rogi Riverstone aka the Untouchable sheesh

posted by Rogi  # 1/07/2007 11:38:00 AM

alt.discuss lamers 

You're reading http://msntv.blogspot.com

wrote this to some peeps in the New Mexico newsgroup:

You are cluttering up a good news group with stuff the rest of us don't
want to see.

If you want to argue, do it where it's chartered by alt. discuss:

But I'll bet NONE of you has the courage to play in the DEEP end,

Go THERE and leave us ALONE!

You're in violation of your MSNTV Terms Service and could lose your

You people look like rank ameteurs.

Your sigs have live rams in them, which can choke WebTV Classics (old)
and power them off. You offer NO warnings in your posts.

MOST of you steal bandwidth by direct linking images and sound files in
your sigs. That costs people MONEY! From source viewing your posts, I
see you're stealing from friends of mine!

ALL CAPS in subject heads and replies is much more difficult to read,
and is considered shouting. You're yelling at people who aren't even
involved. If it's hard for you to see, go get one of the dozens of
low-vision tools out there, created just for WebTV users.

Grow UP! The world doesn't revolve around your petty garbage.

posted by Rogi  # 1/07/2007 09:20:00 AM


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